Interview with Professional Latin Champions Massimo Arcolin & Laura Zmajkovicova - Part I

In the middle of gruelling preparations to organise the 6th Brillante International DanceSport Championship, there was a day that I looked forward to in particular - when I received the opportunity to sit down and have a virtual chat with our special guest artistes.

It was a thrill to ask two of my favourite Professional dancers (who were gracious enough to pardon my excitement) about a great variety of topics. Our wide ranging conversation has been documented in two parts, for your enjoyment.

Read on and be inspired by the insightful musings of the incomparable Massimo Arcolin & Laura Zmajkovicova.

How does it feel to return as a guest artiste at the 6th Brillante after being Champions at the 2nd Brillante, back in 2015? I’m not sure if you still remember that!

Laura: Yes! Of course we remember, because it was one of our first competitions, in our early days together. And actually, I think I even danced in the first one, with my previous partner. So yes, very happy to be back!

We are definitely looking forward, and are very excited to perform in Singapore again. We love Melvin and Sharon - I think the events they put together are excellent.

Massimo: In general, it’s also been a long time since we’ve performed there.

Laura: Yes, we haven’t been to Singapore for a while, so we’re very excited to be there. We know a lot of people in Singapore, so I think they will come to support us as well. It’ll be nice to see familiar faces, as well as some new faces - we are really looking forward to that!

Massimo Arcolin & Laura Zmajkovicova, Champions of the Latin Professional Open at the 2nd Brillante International DanceSport Championship.

We’re very much looking forward to welcoming you both as well! What can we expect from the special performance you’ll be bringing us this year?

Laura: Well, we always work really hard to prepare special shows. We would spend a lot of time and energy - and money - to build really special pieces, for every dance. We don't take it for granted. It’s not the same as our competition performances, but our show performance always has something special, something you might not see on a competition floor.

We love developing and creating it, because we feel that it always gets us to move our limits to another level as well. We get to explore something new that, perhaps later, we bring even to our competitive dancing.

Massimo: And of course, every year, we try to change something between our shows. Maybe we cannot change all the shows, every time, but we always try to.

Laura: But all the shows that we will be dancing are ones that nobody in Singapore has seen yet, so I think they're all new shows! We have danced them before, but not yet in Singapore, so it’ll be completely new for our Singaporean audience.

Massimo: The important thing is that they don't watch Laura’s Instagram. Otherwise… (Laura laughs)

No, I think it really is different when you see it live!

Massimo: For sure!

Laura: Absolutely, the energy of the performance is completely different when it’s live.

Speaking of creating new choreographies for each show, how do you actually conceptualise each piece that you want to do? Do you start with the music, or perhaps a story?

Massimo: It's a long process…

Laura: Yes, it really depends…

Massimo: First, we start with a fight (both laugh) to decide on the music, because we have completely different tastes.

Laura: Yea, many times, especially when it comes to Samba, we always have different opinions. It takes time to find the common one that we will both be happy with. We are both very picky, with strong personalities, as you can see.

Massimo: But usually, we start with music first, because we get inspired from music. Sometimes we see videos and get inspiration from there, to pick up some kind of energy, or some kind of concept.

It’s always different, becomes sometimes, we already have a concept in mind, and then we search for the right music. Other times, we hear music somewhere, and immediately say, okay, this - we can use it, and then, we take it from there.

Laura: I am very visual in my imagination, so I often imagine a scene, or imagine some kind of picture or visual that I would like to see and surprise the audience with, from the very first moment that the show starts.

A moment from Massimo & Laura's dramatic Paso Doble, performed at the 6th Brillante.

For example, I might imagine a scene of someone laying on the floor, and then something starting to develop from there, and so on. In that way, it doesn’t always start with the music, but that is many times the inspiration.

We might find a beautiful piece of music, but we always keep actively looking. We spend hours and days and months to search for the right music - we always want to find something that no one has ever used before, something original.

Massimo: Of course, many times, we combine it with other kinds of sounds, or other music.

Laura: Yea, we find ways to combine some songs that, maybe, people would not think to combine together. That's also a good inspiration for us.

Different styles, as well. We like to bring in a little bit from different styles, not just original Latin. Maybe some steps from Hip Hop and so on…

Massimo: I can say that we almost never start from steps. Probably, maybe 90% of the time, it doesn’t start with, “oh, we have this step, we need to do it in a show”, no.

Laura: Yes, it could be the mood or the story instead.

 I often imagine a scene, or imagine some kind of picture or visual that I would like to see and surprise the audience with, from the very first moment that the show starts.

One of the most memorable things you’ve done that comes to mind is the show with the table - I’ve never seen people bring a table, and a girl on top of the table, to the dance floor - so I understand what you mean, and I really appreciate the amount of effort that you put into making sure each show is unforgettable in that way.

Massimo: No table this year though!

Laura: We always had to buy the same table, in every country. We’d tell each organiser, “this is the exact table we need”, because of the size and structure we needed. We had a table in China, then we had one in Taiwan, in London, in Italy, Hong Kong… every country we went, even in Dubai.

Massimo: There was only time time that we were not able to get that exact table from IKEA. I had to manage with a different table. It was a little bit harder, but in the end, we could manage!

I heard that for one of the tables, you actually got everyone to sign the top, and you kept it?

Laura: Correct! We have it at home, with all the signatures.

Massimo: Yea, that was in Italy!

That sounds awesome! So when you finish a show, whether it’s a competition or a performance, what makes you feel like you’ve done a good job?

Laura: Actually, we are very critical, so that’s a good question!

Massimo: Veeery critical, both of us.

Laura: But I think it’s important to always set some kind of goal. For us, most of the time, it’s not really tied to a result. Of course, it’s great when the results are there, but I think it’s difficult to achieve something when you have your mind on just a number.

It’s always better when it is set on a goal, something physical that you want to achieve, or something you want to surpass.

Massimo: For example, if we’ve just created a new show, we might feel ready when we are rehearsing it by ourselves, but when it is our first time performing it on a stage, the goal is to be able to do it in front of everybody.

Even though we have been dancing for many years, the show would still be a new one, so for us to be able to do it well, perform it, and have it come out nicely… that’s the goal.

We pay attention to that feeling when we’re dancing, so many times after we finish we might look at each other like, okay, this was good. Then, after we repeat the show a few times, we start to become more critical - that time was better, or this time was better than the previous two, the energy was better, and so on.

In that way, the goal is always important to us, but it can be a different thing that we are looking forward to each time.

Laura: Although, on one hand, we are very critical, I do still come back to the thought that, I have done the best I could at that moment. That is the goal, always. Sometimes, you know, you have a better day, and sometimes you have a worse day. That can happen to anyone, even to Professionals.

It doesn’t matter how much you train - you’re still a human, so at the end of the day, the most important thing is if I really did everything I could. I’m always happy with that, because I think we always go full power.

Massimo: That is probably the common thing, between the shows and competition.

Laura: Absolutely.

The goal is always important to us, but it can be a different thing we are looking forward to each time.

Massimo: I mean, we know that we cannot repeat the same thing all the time, because it comes a little too… robotic, let’s say. So each time will be slightly different, whether it’s the day, or the feeling for each other.

We try to have it fresh all the time, to renew something inside of ourselves. That’s the main point, and to give a hundred percent each time.

And of course, the appreciation from the people watching. It’s a bonus, because I feel that if the audience doesn’t like something, they don’t stand up.

If they feel like they are not getting something from us, of course it’ll be more difficult for them to stand up - at least that’s how I feel - so the appreciation is not something that we search for, but we stay focused on our job, and the way the audience react is then just a result of that. But of course, we are very happy when it happens!

I’ll be making sure everyone at my table stands up then!

Laura: (laughs) No worries at all!

So, when you’ve completed a show, and are preparing for the next one, I’m sure you want to make it even better than before. When you are rehearsing each day, though, there isn’t really a report card at the end of the day saying, “you did your best today”, so how do you really know…

Massimo: Don’t worry, there is a report… (Laura laughs)

Really? Do you give each other a report?

Massimo: Perhaps not on the same day. Sometimes we find that when we tell each other things on the same day - or even the hour straight after the show, when we are in the room or something - we can talk about it, but then we let go a little, because usually, it’s too fresh and your reaction may be too… impulsive.

So then we head to sleep and come back to it at a later time, and then we actually start to look at it with a clearer head. We can start to talk about, Did this work? No, this didn’t work, let’s make it better.

That makes sense! But do you think there’s a way we can measure whether or not we are doing our best?

Laura: Absolutely. I think as you try something more and more, you’re going to feel whether it’s working, or whether you’re getting better at the ability. You have to start listening to this, because as many of our close teachers still often say, “The best teacher is yourself. You know yourself the best.”

And it’s really true, because if you are honest with yourself, you know whether you really put all your effort into the step, or into the movement, or into your practice, or whether you’re kind of just walking around and marking it, and so on. You’ll know that very well.

And you can always check with a video - we do that often, because many times, you feel like you did something, but then you check the video and you’re like… yea, not really. Or, we ask each other: Can you please have a look at this? What do you think? Can you see that I’m trying to do this? Is it coming out? And so on.

We help each other in this way, but I think the more and more you try it, the more you will feel it - yes, I am always in balance, or, yes, I start to feel the power in my body.

You have to start, I think, asking the questions and then finding the answers to those questions, whether it’s by yourself, or, when you can’t find it yourself, by asking someone, like your partner or your teacher. The important thing is that the drive is coming from you.

Massimo: Yes, because of course, many times, what you feel inside could be different from what she sees from the outside, or what you see, or what the teachers see.

Laura: Sure, but when it comes to the measurement, I think you do know. Even when we teach, I often ask the couple - especially when it’s a new couple that I don’t know so well, where I feel that they know each other better than I know them - if they could mark themselves at that moment from 1 to 10, ten being the best they can do that day, how many points they would give themselves. Many times, people say four, or five, or six. Sometimes, they say seven. Very rarely does somebody say ten.

And so, when you say it’s not a 10, that mean there’s something missing. It may not be something that I can teach you, or that anybody else needs to teach you. Using whatever you know right now, do your 10, every time. If I really focus on doing the best I can each time, I’m sure the improvement will get faster.

And then, you know, when you finish doing the step and ask yourself, “Was it my 10?” and you answer, “Yes!”, it might turn out that on the video, it still doesn’t look okay.

In that case, you know that maybe you need to change it a little bit, but the first thing is, you always have to go to the most of what you can do in that moment. It doesn’t always mean the biggest, but rather the most concentrated, using your body the most, and so on. In that way, I think you can start to measure yourself more and more, you know?

Using whatever you know right now, do your 10, every time.

Yea, I think that’s a very helpful answer! So, when you talk about practising together with your partner, what does a typical practice session look like for the both of you?

Laura: I think it depends a little bit on the period of time, and what we are preparing for.

Massimo: And, at different points in our career together, it has also been different. For example, now, the practice is more specific, compared to the beginning.

Laura: In the beginning, of course, you try to make everything work together and so on. Now, I think we have danced enough together that we know each other pretty well and…

Massimo: It’s more detailed, in a way. It’s less general.

Laura: Yes, and what I think is very important for us as a structure is always understanding what the goal of the practice is. You always have to have a goal for every task, whether it’s for your day, or for this week, or the month. You always have a goal, so that is a constant for us.

How we practise then depends on that, because if we have come home from a major event, like we just did, then we have to analyse, of course - what has to be better, what was really good, what we want to keep strengthening, and so on - but we always start by going back to the base, you know? We start stripping down all the energy and going back to the slower motions, and so on.

Massimo: Of course, you have your warm up first. We always start separately, because most fights during practice start when you get in touch immediately…

Laura: …when you are not ready yet.

Massimo: Yes, so we have learnt to start separately, to warm ourselves up, to be ready with our own bodies first. And then we get in touch.

Laura: The length of all this warm up, or the dancing together, or even what we are dancing together, all depends on the period. For example, after a major event, like now, we would normally practise three hours a day, and we would start slowly, pace it accordingly.

We would spend time apart first, maybe half an hour, or slightly less, and then start to work on what we want to improve on.

Massimo: Of course, it could also be different subjects. She could practise something, and I could practise something else. Even if we are dancing together, it could be different things that we are working on for ourselves.

Then, if you look at the week, we also structure the week in different ways. You have some days when you work on more technical stuff, maybe for that particular choreography or that particular dance.

You plan on which day to do stamina training and rounds with all five dances, so it’s not so much about the details, more like a competition. Sometimes you have a show coming up, so you practise for the show. It always depends.

Laura: But I think it’s really important that no matter what period it is, whether we are preparing for a competition, or if we are just in a training period, to always make sure that we balance how many dances are practised in each session.

Many times, people make that mistake where they practise Rumba, and then, the next day, they still hadn’t finished practising the Rumba from the day before, so they continue practising it, and then, by the end of the week, maybe they manage to get to Cha Cha, maybe. So we make sure that we work on a minimum of 3 dances, every practice.

Massimo: But through the week, you need to have all five dances done. Then, the next week, you can still come back to the same five dances and work on different points of each dance.

Laura: If it is a competition period, then we definitely practise five dances a day, for sure. Even if you have only 20 minutes per dance, that’s already good enough.

Changing gears now to talk about your experiences being a dance teacher, I remember attending your online lectures with TDA during the pandemic.

I felt intimidated at the idea of learning from Professionals at first, but after joining the class, I realised it was a very comfortable and enriching environment. It makes me look forward to learning more at the dance camp this time around as well!

When you are going into a class or lecture to teach, what is your priority, and what is the mindset that you approach your students with?

Laura: Well, of course, for me, the priority is always to inspire people, and to give them knowledge to help them move towards whatever their goal is, because I think everybody is dancing for slightly different reasons. It might be a bit of everything, or it might be just one goal, you know.

So I always try to look at the group. I always ask the organiser: Who are the students? Are they all soloists? Is it all couples? Are they competitors? Are there more Pro-Am students? 

I think everybody has a little bit of a different goal in what they want to achieve, and why they are dancing, and what their excitement about dancing is. I always aim to definitely go towards that direction.

Laura & Massimo posing for a group photo with us after a Zoom workshop back in August 2020.

Massimo: Of course, many times, the topic is already assigned by your own teacher, or the organiser, so we follow that.

Laura: In that case, we try to give our knowledge, as much as we know about it. Maybe some tricks that we have experience with - whether it helps us, or I can see that it works for the students…

Massimo: Basically, we try to share what could work, and what could help all the dancers in the group. Especially because we are still competing, we feel that although we are teachers, we are also still competitors, just like the students.

In that way, we feel more connected with them, so we try to let them feel that we are the same. We are just at different levels because of the years of experience and how many years of work we have done, but that is possible for everybody, in a way.

Especially because we are still competing, we feel that although we are teachers, we are also still competitors, just like the students.

That does resonate with how I felt! Often, I think when we attend classes, there is that sense of needing to keep a distance from the teacher, but it didn’t feel that way at all in your classes.

Massimo: The distance is something that, personally, I have never liked. I never had a teacher like that before, but I have had experiences like that, so of course, I always said to myself, “I want to be the most human, as I am with my friends. Professional, of course, but I want to connect with people.” I don’t want to be out of touch.

Laura: Yea, I think we are also very lucky, with the teachers we have around us. They are very human as well, even though they are great champions.

Massimo: It’s also because we know how the dancers feel, because we have been on the other side, and are still on the other side, many times. We know what it feels like when the opposite happens in a class…

Laura: I think encouragement is important. Of course, I am often strict as well, but it’s never from a place of trying to put someone down, which I really can’t stand when some of the teachers do.

That is something that I really, really don’t tolerate, but yes, I am absolutely happy to say the truth to people, to show that hey, maybe this is not really working, or this is something you really need to work on, because otherwise, the results will not be the way you want them to be.

It’s not easy, and I am continuing to learn about saying the truth even more, because while I think it’s not easy for someone to hear it, it’s always about the way you say it to people, and how you find a solution. I’m definitely very solution oriented, so whatever problem there is, there must always be a solution.

I think we are also very lucky, with the teachers we have around us. They are very human as well, even though they are great champions.

Let’s talk a bit more about that mindset. You mentioned that you’re solution oriented, but at the same time, would you say that you’re more goal oriented or process oriented?

Massimo: I think it’s a mix of it.

Laura: I think so too, because for us, the goal has always been the focus of where we are going, and in this, I think we are not compromising. We are still focused on the goal, and that will never change.

Massimo: We know what we want, for sure, but the thing is, how do we want to achieve it? It’s not easy, but we want to do it in our own way.

We don’t want to have an “It doesn’t matter,” kind of approach. For example, if somebody says, “Just pay everybody, and you’re gonna make it!”, that is not the way.

I would prefer to stay second or third, without a win, and instead achieve more connection or feel the appreciation from the people, because in a way, those results don’t matter.

Laura: We would still be sticking to our goal as well, because the results - they’re never really the goal.

Massimo: There is always a goal that we want to achieve, but for me, the way that we get there has to also always be our own, in a way that we are comfortable with. That’s why I say it’s a mix of both.

It makes sense that in order to perform at a high level, you need to have a mix…

Laura: Absolutely, and the process, many times, may even become the goal. You’re right, because in the end, sometimes, you realise it’s much more fun than actually arriving where you wanted to.

Continued in Part II, to be published shortly!